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| Porn Users Forum » Based on experience - why bother join pay sites? |
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| 08-28-14 02:10pm - 3769 days | Original Post - #1 | |
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Schirm (0)
Suspended Posts: 18 Registered: Dec 27, '13 Location: Sweden |
Based on experience - why bother join pay sites? Maybe it was the very existence of Pornusers.com and the reviews here that made me overccme my initial hesitation and gave it a try to join pay sites with adult content. For me the most obvious reason to join a paysite is to get quality: the bitrate and technical quality of dvds has set the standard for me, and tubesites obviously fail hard in this aspect. With experience gained from a few different memberships, and more reviews here on PU, I now find myself hesitating once again. Thanks to at least one in a very limited group of well-renowned paysites my email account has become heavily spammed. I will never join neither of the suspected sites again. Since then I considered to join but decided against the following sites: Videobox: great collection of dvd movies, which when it comes to technical quality has more in common with free tube sites than the source dvd material. Pay for lousy, inferior quality? Of course not. Anal educator: site has obvious problems with currency converters and should as far as Im concerned be avoided based on their history of business decisions and customer relation practices. Trust gone during the joining process. Reality kings: membership terms limit daily download to 10 gb. For me download is the only option (my mediaplayer dont stream from web). 10 gb HD material per day is next to nothing - why even bother?? Brazzers: cross-selling (which is now illegal in EU) and many comments here on PU mention aggressive and sneaky advertising/membership offerings. Click somewhere and get billed for some unwanted service? NO THANKS! I would happily pay for quality in both technical and customer relation standards, but for some reason a free, open global internet market gives convincing examples of the very opposite. So why bother? I welcome your views and experiences on this subject. | |
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| 08-28-14 07:10pm - 3769 days | #2 | |
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pat362 (0)
Active User  Posts: 3,575 Registered: Jan 23, '07 Location: canada |
I don't know if the thrust of your post is to advocate going the free porn route but if it isn't than it certainly looks like it. The only reason why you should always go the pay site route is because if you don't then you forever lose the right to offer an opinion about porn because you didn't pay for it. Worse you stole it. Here is an example. If a restaurant offers free samples and you say that they aren't very good after tasting them than that's okay because you didn't have to buy them to taste them. If you steal the food than just shut up about the quality as it didn't cost you anything but it certainly cost the restaurant money to make that food. I don't know about you but I have gone to some restaurants and the food was not that great but I still paid my bill and tipped the waitress because it wasn't her fault the food wasn't to my liking. I wouldn't have had any problem saying to the manager that the food was not really to my linking if he had asked me because I had paid for it. The main reason why you should pay for porn is because nothing in life is free. What you think of as free tube porn is in fact porn that people like me and many others have paid for. if we all used tube sites than there would be less porn getting made and most of what would be made would be pretty mediocre or bad. Case in point the current state of the porn industry in the world. There are tons of studios that were active less than a decade ago that are not anymore. They didn't choose to stop making porn. They simply couldn't afford to do it for free. 1-Videobox is an amazing site to join because you get many thousands of movies for less than 15$. The quality is not the greatest on many of them but that's because those movies are often 5 or more years old and many of them are significantly older. The quality may not be great but it's still superior to most Tube sites. 2-I grant you that anal educator is not a good example to use when talking about paying for porn because the content is a few years old and the guy who owns it is sort of a dick but the great thing is that you don't have to join it to find out about it. 3-RK is another great site with many thousands of videos which you can access for less than 20$. There is some kind of daily download limit but read rearadmirals recent review to find out that it's not as clear cut as you make it seem. Even if it is than a one month membership will still give you about 300G of videos. Seeing as only the videos since 2010 are in HD than you should be able to download most of their library in one month. 4-Brazzer is an amazing site with again many thousands of videos which you get for less than 20$. They may do some cross-selling but then again every site does it and most tube sites do the same. I'm not aware of the clicking somewhere and getting charged for something because I was a member for over 2 years and that never happened to me. Long live the Brown Coats. | |
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| 08-29-14 05:08am - 3768 days | #3 | |
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AWpress (0)
Active Webmaster  Posts: 118 Registered: Nov 20, '12 Location: The Netherlands |
Cool tip, if you use gmail, you can put the sitename into the email address you supply them after a '+' symbol. For example: myemailaddress@gmail.com becomes myemailaddress+yourspammywebsite@gmail.com The email address still works, and mail to the modified address will come to your inbox as normal - except the 'to:' address will indicate the full, modified email. This way, if you start getting a lot of spam, you can look at the 'to:' address to see which site sold your details to spammers. Anyhow, as to why you should buy porn, I'm in slight disagreement with pat362 above- I don't think it's up to people to do it because it's the right thing to do. Instead, I think paysites have a sink-or-swim responsibility to make paying better than the free stuff. And plenty of sites do. Free porn, (both from affiliate sites, and unlicenced filesharing sites), comes with a lot of spam, ads, adware, spyware, and malware. The quality is generally lower. The range is generally better. Paysites ought not to spam their customer-base; if you pay to use a site, you shouldn't have to expect ads, and certainly not malware. The quality should be higher. Navigation should be safer and easier. Of course, there are shitty sites that take money, and then go ahead and spam the hell out of their users. The best protection against that is being informed, and sites like this one are a great way of getting informed. For the industry as a whole to overcome freeporn, paid porn will need to offer similar or better range than the free stuff. At the moment, videobox is the best example of that, but there's still a long way to go. The folks here are working on a site called myporn.com that seems to be aiming at similar goalposts (a single curated and aggregated resource). Porn needs a netflix, itunes, spotify, steam, googleplay equivalent. Disclaimer: the above opinion comes from someone working for a paysite. | |
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| 08-29-14 09:14am - 3768 days | #4 | |||||||
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Schirm (0)
Suspended Posts: 18 Registered: Dec 27, '13 Location: Sweden |
Thats a low from from you dear Pat. My concern for technical video quality is as obvious in my post as its lacking in tube sites. I prefer to dismiss your wrong assumption with a harsh reality check: tube sites exists and is a market reality. Wether pay sites likes it or not, they are competing with free. Some tube and pay sites might share owners, who use one to promote the other. I would gladly discuss tubesites, but thats a different topic not belonging here. My topic concerns pay sites only.
There is no reason to embrace "pay site routes" or any other business "route" where paying customers are subjected to dubious tricks as a consequence of deliberate business decisions.
Ownership and economy of tube sites are fascinating topics, and deserve a proper topic separate from my posting here if you would like a proper response from me.
Theres nothing amazing about poor quality and other remarks in recent reviews. A Videobox with bitrates/technical quality on source dvd level would however be amazing and have me as a long-time member.
Word! 
Its hard not to take offense by your biased assumptions: go read the site terms yourself to find the figure 10GB clearly stated. Should the terms not be clear on this, please dont blame me for how the site presents their terms. You are welcome to your opinions, but please respect I find your constant admiration of pay sites bad practices increasingly biased in their favour.
There is no real excuse for cross-selling, and in EU this practice is now illegal. Ignorance might be a bliss, but Lester1's comment thread on brazzers seem to disagree with your opinion stated above. Dear Pat, obviously you dont share my concerns and I really do respect your opinion. Am sorry if you take personal offense by me critizing your beloved sites, but we all have our own opinions. | |||||||
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| 08-29-14 09:30am - 3768 days | #5 | ||
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Schirm (0)
Suspended Posts: 18 Registered: Dec 27, '13 Location: Sweden |
The very existence of pay sites clearly shows people are willing to pay, and so am I, thats why Im here on PU. Maybe pay sites would do better if they better adhered to the very basics of a sound business practice you stated above.
Am glad there seems to be hope. May I ask what site you work for? | ||
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| 08-29-14 12:37pm - 3768 days | #6 | |
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Khan (0)
Suspended  Posts: 1,737 Registered: Jan 05, '07 Location: USA |
Are you not aware that if you click on a webmaster's name here in the forum you bring up their profile ... which has their website? Clicking on a regular user's name brings up their profile as well. He's with AbbyWinters.com, btw. Hope that helps. Former PornUsers Senior Administrator Now at: MyPorn.com "To get your ideas across use small words, big ideas, and short sentences."-John Henry Patterson | |
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| 08-29-14 01:30pm - 3768 days | #7 | |
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thirstyfish (0)
Active User  Posts: 30 Registered: May 20, '13 |
It doesn't sound to me that Schirm is advocating ditching pay sites in favor of tube sites. What I'm hearing is that the things you'd expect to get from a pay site (quality content, reliable and above board business practices, and respect for customers' privacy) are often missing. And if those things are missing from a pay site, why do business with them? My main reasons for dropping a site subscription are: predictable content or no new content, billing problems, sharing personal info, incomplete performer data, poor search facilities, poor presentation layer/UI, reduced functionality/feature set. Note that "predictable content" is a subjective call on my part: I enjoy cinematic scenes (as opposed to POV) and scenes that focus on the women - not the guys. Fortunately, my e-mail provider has pretty good spam filtering so most of it never makes it to my in-box. But there's no doubt that my e-mail address has been shared around. My spam box is full of rubbish that is the result of subscribing to pay sites. Porn happens because a large number of things amazingly fail to go wrong. | |
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| 08-29-14 01:45pm - 3768 days | #8 | |
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Khan (0)
Suspended Posts: 1,737 Registered: Jan 05, '07 Location: USA |
Then perhaps a better question would be, "Why join *some* pay sites? I know there are tons of good pay sites out there. But I also know if you only subscribe to budget sites who's target audience are those looking for large volume then you can't be too surprised when you don't get the cream of the crop. But hey, everyone's entitled to their own opinion. But they are not entitled to use our forum to promote tube sites. But maybe he didn't intend that as much as he just hoped to open a dialog on quality pay sites. Former PornUsers Senior Administrator Now at: MyPorn.com "To get your ideas across use small words, big ideas, and short sentences."-John Henry Patterson | |
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| 08-29-14 09:01pm - 3768 days | #9 | ||
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Schirm (0)
Suspended Posts: 18 Registered: Dec 27, '13 Location: Sweden |
Most of the sites I explicitly mentioned in my post are top rated here on PU, and if they dont belong in the cream of the crop, which site does?
Could you please explain on what basis the claim I might promote tube sites is founded? | ||
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| 08-29-14 11:11pm - 3767 days | #10 | ||
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Khan (0)
Suspended Posts: 1,737 Registered: Jan 05, '07 Location: USA |
Schirm, no-one (at least not me) is accusing you of anything so there's no reason to become defensive. You say ...
That is true, they are top rated here. That is because many users feel that getting access to a whole lot of porn at a very reasonable price, is a good value. Thus, they rate them highly. As far as what sites are the cream ... that will, of course, depend on *your* criteria of a good site. Between TBP's reviews and site facts and the reviews from your fellow users here at PU, you can usually tell how a site will stack up in the areas you feel are important. What you might consider doing is starting a thread where you say what is of the highest value to *you* and asking your fellow users for their recommendations. But that's just my 2¢  As far as ...
As I said, no-one is accusing you of promoting tube sites. However, you did say, "Ownership and economy of tube sites are fascinating topics, and deserve a proper topic separate from my posting here if you would like a proper response from me." and "I would gladly discuss tubesites, but thats a different topic not belonging here." So now, should that discussion come about, you'll be clear that promoting them would not be welcome. That might include things like recommending people use tube sites rather than pay sites or posting links to specific tube sites or recommending them by name. So, if you never plan to do any of those things, fantastic, we're good.  Just so there's no misunderstanding of what I'm saying ... a *general* discussion of tube sites would be fine. Though not my personal favorite, still, if that's a discussion you guys want to have, it'll be ok. In fact, I'm thinking we've had a few discussions on the subject already, Hope that helps clear things up and takes away any concern you may have had about being accused of doing something wrong. Former PornUsers Senior Administrator Now at: MyPorn.com "To get your ideas across use small words, big ideas, and short sentences."-John Henry Patterson | ||
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| 08-30-14 08:37am - 3767 days | #11 | |||
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Schirm (0)
Suspended Posts: 18 Registered: Dec 27, '13 Location: Sweden |
Thank you for clarifying that. 
That was said clearly in reply to Pat, and I have no intention of starting such a topic.
Yes, we are! To bring this thread back to topic: my concern is the obvious shortcomings mentioned above: lacking technical quality such as low bitrates compared to source dvd material, and widespread bad practices against customers/members. Cross-selling, regional pricing, ads, spamming and other means of deceptive methods which members/customers are subjected to by pay sites should be banned from any internet business to be considered safe, trustworthy and serious. TBP and PU does warn for cross-selling, but takes no further action against such sites, and use a scoring system with no bearing on such shortcomings. In lack of proper legislation, it would be welcome if the "industry" set their own standards higher, so that their customers wouldnt have to be worried about being spammed, subjected to charges not actively and intentionally agreed upon etc. Generally speaking, with the sites mentioned above in mind, I more or less has to begin any joining process by distrusting that very site from start: they are expected to try deceiving me into agreements with precheck boxes at more or less obvious positions. I cannot even be sure of getting the stated usual 30 days of membership if I dont want any recurring charges: I have already experienced problems in cancelling memberships, a process which by many site terms now can take days. Comments on brazzers even suggests membership will end the very same day if cancelled in advance. So - why bother with paysites? In general terms, paysites seems to put more effort into maintaining a supposedly shady reputation commonly associated with adult business, instead of clearly commit themselves to improvment and set high standards. Here I feel both PU and TBP could do more, and therefore I started this topic to get member views on this. In other words: back to topic  Edited on Aug 30, 2014, 08:43am | |||
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| 08-30-14 10:52am - 3767 days | #12 | |
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pat362 (0)
Active User Posts: 3,575 Registered: Jan 23, '07 Location: canada |
^All right than if you think that paid sites are bad than what is your suggestion for anyone wanting to watch porn? Be advised that it can't be something that doesn't exist because no one can join an idea. I need suggestions for existing products that you enjoy now or did in the last year. Long live the Brown Coats. | |
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| 08-30-14 11:25am - 3767 days | #13 | |
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Schirm (0)
Suspended Posts: 18 Registered: Dec 27, '13 Location: Sweden |
Sorry dear Pat, go advise and demand suggestions elsewhere. I wont be feeding your obvious need to defend bad practices and lacking quality among pay sites. | |
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| 08-30-14 06:34pm - 3767 days | #14 | |
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pat362 (0)
Active User Posts: 3,575 Registered: Jan 23, '07 Location: canada |
^Than I must conclude that my original thought about your post was a way to talk about people going the free porn route and how there is nothing wrong with doing that because porn studios are cheaters out to screw customers. Of course that is just my opinion so you can go ahead and write whatever you like as I will no longer read or add anything to this thread. Long live the Brown Coats. | |
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| 08-31-14 12:38am - 3766 days | #15 | |
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Schirm (0)
Suspended Posts: 18 Registered: Dec 27, '13 Location: Sweden |
I completely deny Pats wrong conclusion and false assumption about my intention: this is the second attempt to hijack this thread by Pat by poiting his finger to the "free route". This thread is about pay sites only. Adult pay sites are supposed to be legitimate businesses and open to critique just like any other legitimate business on a free market. Many pay sites, again in general terms, puts deliberate effort into various attemps to cheat their customers by unfair membership terms, cross-selling, regional pricing etc. I now find myself reluctant to join pay sites because of such practices, which seems so widespread that sites can justifiy their own participation by saying "we just do what everybody else already does". With the basic trust gone, what reason are there for pay sites to expect new members to join and stay? Would not the whole "industry" benefit by raising its standards and better adher to sound customer practices? What are you fellow members views and opinions on this? In other words - back to topic | |
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| 08-31-14 06:18am - 3766 days | #16 | |
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Cybertoad (0)
Disabled User  Posts: 2,158 Registered: Jan 01, '08 Location: Wash |
Toads take, I have been on all ends of the spectrum when it comes to acquiring porn online. Let look at facts. 1. both pay and free are in it for the money not to give aging old men a boner.   .2. Almost 99% of the free-sites I have ever checked out set off my spam detectors and even malware. Never has occurred on pay sites for me. 3. Everyone uses Facebook, google, twitter, and forums and "ALL" of your material even my post is sifted by bots. I agree with the premise that the emails are sold on pay sites know it to be 99% factual. I joined Babes.com with anew email and walla a week later porn ads. But I am sure its not the site and is the billing. Example: CCBILL policy . CCBil may share any information about you and your company when required by third parties in processing credit cards and online checks. Now children what information is included when processing your online billing..... wait for it,.........wait for it. EVERYTHING, name address, age and email. You just agreed that they can do any fucking thing they want with it LOL. That does not protect you from what third parties will do with it but you gave them rights to provide it.. Most billers have this nice padded disclosure in the middle where they tell you your privacy is important. They then say in plain English we can share your shit with anyone we need to. Not Picking on CCbill they are usually good and honest, the point was even the biggest of all billers says they can share your shit. (and I bet at price too). Point is also, ( not picking on OP) anyone reading the small print? Well I can tell you 100% they are selling your information legally. Because its in disclosures !!!! My site says on it I will ( dumb it down). The long agreement says in one of the paragraphs. I own what you do here, its mine and I can do what I want with it when ever, where-ever, and how ever I please. And own anything you provide me like pictures video etc. Guess what I am flooded 20,000 visits a month by people agreeing to that . People do not often read, and I have it in place not to screw a member or sell anything but to protect the rights I need to protect others and if the authorities come a knocken I had Bobs shit right over with legal cause. Moral of the story, read the small print on any site free or not, or don't bitch about it. again OP not attacking you this was my open general thought. Since 2007 Edited on Aug 31, 2014, 06:26am | |
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