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| 1-36 of 36 Posts | Page 1 |
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| 03-22-19 12:25pm - 2008 days | Original Post - #1 | |
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mbaya (0)
Suspended  Posts: 891 Registered: Jul 07, '08 Location: new jersey |
asian sex diary I contacted Freddie yesterday. She told me she has the flu. I hope she is getting better. She also told me that she would bring my request to Mike C for a decision. I wrote a review on Tuesday of Asian Sex Diary that the webmaster did not like. I think it would be appropriate if he were suspended, or even worse, banned for life. PU does not need trolls or even hostile webmasters. I wanted to keep this as quiet as I could until an answer came back from MikeC. This has always been a site for pornusers to express opinions freely without fear of harassment. It is not a site for webmasters to belittle past, present or future customers or their honest opinions. Since I see responses from Shen, Jook and Exotics, I think it is time for everyone to see the situation for themselves. What should be done if anything? I do not mind at all if one of us disagrees with anything I write. I don't take it personally, but apparently the webmaster does. "Fake News"? Sounds familiar, I think I have heard that before. But where? Edited on Mar 22, 2019, 01:21pm | |
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| 03-22-19 02:40pm - 2008 days | #2 | |
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mbaya (0)
Suspended Posts: 891 Registered: Jul 07, '08 Location: new jersey |
I see many of the silent lurkers have read this. If you have never participated before this is a good time to start. If you value PU, your post here is welcome. If you like reading real user reviews, your post here is welcome. If you like my reviews, let PU know. If you don't like my reviews, say so. Feel free as long as you are polite. It doesn't matter if you read the heterosexual reviews, the gay reviews, the lesbian ones or any other personal choice. PU needs your input as to what is allowable behavior and what is not. | |
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| 03-22-19 08:56pm - 2008 days | #3 | |
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lk2fireone (0)
Active User  Posts: 3,618 Registered: Nov 14, '08 Location: CA |
I've read your review of the site, and thought the review was excellent: fair, balanced, with many fine and detailed pros, cons, bottom line points. The webmaster of the site was offended by the review. Implied it was fake news, and biased. Any review is slightly biased, by the writer's own beliefs. But you made every effort to make the review fair and impartial, with detailed reasons for the review. Far beyond what most reviews show. Just a suggestion: I suggest making this a PU poll, where you will get more public responses from the PU members. Write it however you want: For example (just an example: write whatever you want)- The mbaya site review of Asian Sex Diary was fair: -Agree. With comments. -Disagree. With comments. -The webmaster response was fair: Agree. With reasons. -The webmaster response was disrespectful. Agree. With reasons. -The webmaster should be banned from the PU site. Agree. With reasons. -The webmaster should not be banned from the PU site: Agree. With reasons. | |
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| 03-23-19 03:12am - 2008 days | #4 | |
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mbaya (0)
Suspended Posts: 891 Registered: Jul 07, '08 Location: new jersey |
I never thought of that as I have never started a poll. I will take that up with Freddie next week. Realistically, not much happens around here on the weekend. | |
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| 03-23-19 07:55am - 2007 days | #5 | |
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rearadmiral (0)
Active User Posts: 1,453 Registered: Jul 16, '07 Location: NB/Canada |
Your unfortunate experience with a webmaster seems to be part of the overall trend to declaring something we don't like to be 'fake news.' I've read your review and it isn't biased at all. Anything neutral or negative is explained. Your reviews are always written this way. The way I approach reviews is to deal with subjective issues up-front and declare any biases. For me though, these biases are often positive. I'll declare that I really, really like a site (Amateur Allure and Daughter Swap, for example) so that a reader is aware that my personal opinion may colour the review. But I still try to be objective. Both Amateur Allure and Daughter Swap could use some improvements and I can objectively state that as much as I love the porn they make. Bottom line is that you shouldn't lose a minute of sleep over this. I recall back maybe eight or ten years ago I wrote a review of a site that wasn't up-front about it being streaming only. The Terms of Service were misleading at best. The owner/webmaster contacted me and threatened to sue me for mentioning that in my review and scoring it lower because of the streaming-only but also because of the sneaky way he dealt with that. The lawsuit threat didn't worry me. The fact that he was Russian did...  | |
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| 03-23-19 08:16am - 2007 days | #6 | |
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mbaya (0)
Suspended Posts: 891 Registered: Jul 07, '08 Location: new jersey |
I remember something that Rick talked about and it might be the case you are referring to. He said that there had been a lawsuit about defamation. it was decided that this is a club requiring membership in order to post opinions. The ruling was in favor of freedom of speech when a member posted. You advised me not to lose sleep. However, my thought here is not only about myself. We cannot allow a precedent of intimidation. Why would someone post a negative opinion about a site if they were concerned about consequences? PU could easily be a place that only existed to promote websites. Who would trust our objectivity? | |
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| 03-23-19 08:52am - 2007 days | #7 | |
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mbaya (0)
Suspended Posts: 891 Registered: Jul 07, '08 Location: new jersey |
There are a great many well written excellent reviews here. I am not the only one who puts a lot of work into them. Of the three reviews this week, the ones I thought were the best were done by Shen. One day he and others will write reviews that may get them some grief, but today it is me. This took three days to write and four revisions. I expected a degree of blow back after Chevys review and the responses to it. I was still surprised. I remember the debacle with Miss Hybrid like it was yesterday. No more! If I can borrow a phrase used about a much bigger, much more serious problem-Never Again! I call on Mike C to stand up for the integrity of this site. So far Shen has gotten a negative, insulting response from this same webmaster. "I beg your pardon, Shen. Please dispense with the self-righteousness. We're talking about porn, here". Jook and Exotics are in line to be next. I hope I am wrong. Edited on Mar 23, 2019, 09:38am | |
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| 03-23-19 10:30am - 2007 days | #8 | |
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mbaya (0)
Suspended Posts: 891 Registered: Jul 07, '08 Location: new jersey |
I see Wittyguy has now responded to the troll webmaster. Is he the next one to be lambasted? | |
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| 03-23-19 10:42am - 2007 days | #9 | |
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Wittyguy (0)
Active User  Posts: 1,138 Registered: Feb 04, '08 Location: Left Coast, USA |
x Edited on Apr 19, 2023, 01:17pm | |
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| 03-24-19 07:31am - 2006 days | #10 | |
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mbaya (0)
Suspended Posts: 891 Registered: Jul 07, '08 Location: new jersey |
In Khan's time a post like that would have been addressed in about ten minutes, even on a weekend. Yes Khan is not coming back, but we also had a tough enough moderator in Amanda, a Rabbits era employee. Once I saw an email from her telling me not to react to a posting. I was surprised that she was on top of it before I even saw it online. She told me that she would suspend the member. Ten minutes later I saw the account had been permanently closed. I seriously doubt there was a meeting or even a discussion. | |
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| 03-24-19 11:48am - 2006 days | #11 | |
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marcdc1 (0)
Active User  Posts: 139 Registered: Jan 10, '07 Location: New York |
Rearadmiral is absolutely right. You gave a well written, honest review. You need not give this any more mental energy. Wow - threatening a lawsuit over a "bad" review. I wonder if people with such issues stay in business  | |
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| 03-25-19 03:10am - 2006 days | #12 | |
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jook (0)
Active User  Posts: 325 Registered: Dec 22, '13 Location: jersey city |
Lots of paralIels here! It was probably about 2 years ago that I gave a lousy unbiased review of a site, I forget which one. The webmaster jumped in just like Asian Sex Diary to defend his site and insult me. I was furious. PU members came to my defense, just like in the ASD review. However, the webmaster proceeded to insult everyone who made a negative comment and a lot more vociferously than in the ASD review. At first, I asked that his site be banned, just like you and others have advocated with ASD. However, after thinking about it, I thought it best to let everything stand so everyone could see the maniacal rantings, not that it was my decision to ban it. [I don't know if the site is still on PU.] I believe the same course of action should be taken with ASD... nothing. Freedom of speech, and all that. Let users draw their own conclusions. I know if I read the review and comments, I would never join based on the webmaster comments alone. I think by leaving it up, it will likely do the site more harm than good. | |
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| 03-25-19 03:37am - 2006 days | #13 | |
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exotics4me (0)
Active User  Posts: 664 Registered: Jan 12, '07 Location: USA |
The really sad part is it does open a lot of old wounds. Webmasters used to constantly bully the members. Especially if you were near the top in points. I had one that was from Los Angeles. I was still in Los Angeles at the time. He posted my IP from his member logs and asked if it was me. I told him yeah and told him to send me an email, I would send him my location. We both found out we had known each other for 15 years. I admittedly mocked him for threatening me. He reported me to PU and said he was going to have to take a restraining order out on me. My email reply to him was something like this, "(his name) you are really threatening me? I can't stop laughing. Let me go lay down outside and cover my eyes so you will have a chance." Nothing threatening from me. A Euro webmaster asked me what I knew about the Russian mafia. I replied, "That they're not as famous or glamorous as the Italian mafia." If I remembered the site or if it's even still listed, I would link that one, Khan replied, "Exotics, have you not heard of The Sopranos spinoff The Smirnovs?" I do not know for sure but like the topic of Ms Hybrid (good catch on it being listed, Witty). Khan wasn't that active in it and if I remember right he "fussed" at a couple of us but he also told me and at least one other "my hands are tied". I joined Asian Sex Diary after reading your review, before seeing Jimmy's comments. I had considered it before. I like John Tron's work on Trike Patrol and Tuk-Tuk Patrol. I haven't had a chance to check it out yet but I kept my two welcome emails for if I do review it. I don't want Jimmy saying I reviewed it from a free trial he gave away. Last, my webmaster from LA story got me in serious trouble on here. I was told, "It is a lot harder to replace a high volume webmaster than a member." Admittedly, I never let that go and it's why I am holding out hope for Rabbit and his staff. If you can't figure out who said that to me, it wasn't Khan. My first time I jacked off, I thought I'd invented it. I looked down at my sloppy handful of junk and thought, This is going to make me rich. - Chuck Palahniuk | |
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| 03-25-19 03:47am - 2006 days | #14 | |
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mbaya (0)
Suspended Posts: 891 Registered: Jul 07, '08 Location: new jersey |
I think everything should stand so that anyone will see the postings. However, it is not ok to let bullying be ignored. | |
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| 03-25-19 03:52am - 2006 days | #15 | |
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mbaya (0)
Suspended Posts: 891 Registered: Jul 07, '08 Location: new jersey |
I also complained to Khan and company during the other disaster. I also was told they wanted to see everything play out and refused to act. I felt their lack of action was a major reason for the subsequent decline in both membership and participation. Further, PU could live without webmaster participation if it came to that. Webmasters don't need freedom of speech here, let alone freedom to harass. This site is for users, hell it is our name. Webmasters are guests here and we are the lifeblood. There have always been different rules for webmasters. As for ASD, I am looking forward to reading your review when the time comes. Edited on Mar 25, 2019, 06:04am | |
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| 03-25-19 01:47pm - 2005 days | #16 | |
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mbaya (0)
Suspended Posts: 891 Registered: Jul 07, '08 Location: new jersey |
As long as the webmaster stays quiet about this, I consider this matter dropped. I was expecting that he could not restrain himself. I hope that I was wrong and he does. I still would like to see an explicit stated policy as to what is acceptable behavior | |
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| 03-25-19 02:58pm - 2005 days | #17 | |
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mbaya (0)
Suspended Posts: 891 Registered: Jul 07, '08 Location: new jersey |
That hope is misplaced. Email me if you want to know why. | |
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| 03-25-19 04:43pm - 2005 days | #18 | |
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Shen (0)
Active User Posts: 31 Registered: Jan 22, '19 Location: UK |
The webmaster may have realised the uproar he has caused and has chosen to opt out. I personally believe that our reviews should be open to some form of criticism, but as soon as he used buzzwords and mantra as Wittyguy said, their integrity ceased. There is no need for this type of conduct whatsoever. Period. We are here to give honest reviews to not only help other fellow porn hobbyists, but to help site owners improve their products aka porn sites. To me, I think the score mbaya gave is what upset him most. This is pathetic really and we should not be coerced into giving scores that are favourable to them. They should reflect our experiences and are also nowhere near as important as they think they are. For clarity's sake, I read mbaya's review again and still can't work out what made him so irate and hostile towards him. | |
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| 03-25-19 05:20pm - 2005 days | #19 | |
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mbaya (0)
Suspended Posts: 891 Registered: Jul 07, '08 Location: new jersey |
I can't imagine how I could have done differently. It was an honest review and I explained everything. The score was the result of what I credited and took off for. I never used that format before as I always thought of a score as a visceral overall number, based on feelings and facts. An impression is based on the whole is more than the sum of its plusses and minuses. I tried to be more objective by explaining in detail. If the uproar stopped him in his tracks, it was worth it. Certainly this was handled better than a series of verbal shouting matches. By the way he thought that if he discredited me people would like his site better. | |
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| 03-25-19 05:30pm - 2005 days | #20 | |
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Loki (0)
Active User  Posts: 395 Registered: Jun 13, '07 Location: California |
Hey mbaya, sorry to read about this bad experience. I read the review and all the responses. I think your review was well-detailed and informative (as usual). I think the webmaster took a strong dislike to your review and was openly hostile and behaving exactly in the manner that we hope to keep PornUsers free of. I haven't been on PU in a while, not even lurking, so I just saw this. I wanted to send you my support and hope this doesn't deter you from writing reviews in the future. I have always felt that pornusers should be an open and respectful community. Reviewers who are afraid to write honest reviews because they're afraid of harassment singularly undermines the mission of pornusers. "A man talking sense to himself is no madder than a man talking nonsense not to himself." | |
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| 03-25-19 05:38pm - 2005 days | #21 | |
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mbaya (0)
Suspended Posts: 891 Registered: Jul 07, '08 Location: new jersey |
It is great to hear from you and thank you. I am undeterred. What about someone who has never written a review and is considering posting? We all want to grow the site. We need those with varying orientations and women especially. We have a spotty record as to being welcoming and now this? | |
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| 03-25-19 05:46pm - 2005 days | #22 | |
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Loki (0)
Active User Posts: 395 Registered: Jun 13, '07 Location: California |
I don't really understand what's so difficult here. A site that relies on users to voluntarily spend their own money and time to get access to sites, then spend hours writing reviews, getting abused on that site? Ban the dude IMMEDIATELY. There have been a few members I have had issues with and they all got banned when they crossed a line. Why are the reviewers held to a higher standard for conduct than the porn sites? It's wrong. I'm really sorry you've gone through this. I just got back to PU after being busy the last few weeks. I immediately read up on the issue and wrote you to let you know some of us out here want to stand up for decency and respectful conduct. Publicly at that. (And if I get banned, so be it. I can stop spending hours writing reviews. I never won first place in the lottery anyway. LOL) "A man talking sense to himself is no madder than a man talking nonsense not to himself." | |
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| 03-25-19 06:19pm - 2005 days | #23 | |
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mbaya (0)
Suspended Posts: 891 Registered: Jul 07, '08 Location: new jersey |
Mike C is Freddie's boss. Feel free to let him know how you feel. | |
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| 03-25-19 06:22pm - 2005 days | #24 | |
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Loki (0)
Active User Posts: 395 Registered: Jun 13, '07 Location: California |
Mike C, please consider the community here. The owner of ASD was abusive. People won't want to contribute here if you let abusive behavior slide. I also find it strange that after 3 days of this thread, there is not a SINGLE comment by PU staff at all. "A man talking sense to himself is no madder than a man talking nonsense not to himself." Edited on Mar 25, 2019, 06:29pm | |
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| 03-25-19 07:07pm - 2005 days | #25 | |
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mbaya (0)
Suspended Posts: 891 Registered: Jul 07, '08 Location: new jersey |
And also not a single comment agreeing with the webmaster's conduct. | |
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| 03-25-19 07:20pm - 2005 days | #26 | |
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Loki (0)
Active User Posts: 395 Registered: Jun 13, '07 Location: California |
From the Terms and Conditions (Updated October, 2018 ): Last line about Prohibited Actions: "To engage in any other conduct that restricts or inhibits anyone's use or enjoyment of the Website, or which, as determined by us, may harm the Company or users of the Website or expose them to liability." From Content Standards: "User Contributions must not: Contain any material which is defamatory, obscene, indecent, abusive, offensive, harassing, violent, hateful, inflammatory, or otherwise objectionable. (and) Cause annoyance, inconvenience, or needless anxiety or be likely to upset, embarrass, alarm, or annoy any other person." Are the Terms and Conditions to apply to the whole PU community, or just to those of us who write reviews? (though I don't do that all that often) "A man talking sense to himself is no madder than a man talking nonsense not to himself." | |
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| 03-26-19 01:00am - 2005 days | #27 | |
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exotics4me (0)
Active User Posts: 664 Registered: Jan 12, '07 Location: USA |
My very first thoughts on ASD is it's a shame the business decisions on this site are going to outweigh the content. I will give it a few more days before at least starting my review on it. Do I have your email or were you saying to email through PU? I would like to know what is going on. I hate picking at a scab but I don't think the staff realizes some us genuinely care about PU, whether it is because of our past friendship with Khan and wanting to help because of that or just because we like helping. Oh and just to update on another part. My girlfriend Tala says she was hoping my female colleague, both a friend to myself of 15 years and to Tala (6 months) would join too. The friend said she was going to join on Tuesday or Wednesday and post in the new member section. She will not be shy. Hopefully, that will give Tala a nudge. My first time I jacked off, I thought I'd invented it. I looked down at my sloppy handful of junk and thought, This is going to make me rich. - Chuck Palahniuk | |
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| 03-26-19 01:19am - 2005 days | #28 | |
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mbaya (0)
Suspended Posts: 891 Registered: Jul 07, '08 Location: new jersey |
We have never emailed, so I know you don't have mine. Try through PU. | |
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| 03-27-19 01:02pm - 2003 days | #29 | |
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mbaya (0)
Suspended Posts: 891 Registered: Jul 07, '08 Location: new jersey |
I submitted this as a new poll in Monday. Today is late Wednesday and no response. The poll is not up and I have not been told no. This is my first time suggesting a poll. How long does it generally take? By the way, if it ever gets live I will give you credit for it. | |
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| 03-27-19 01:24pm - 2003 days | #30 | |
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lk2fireone (0)
Active User Posts: 3,618 Registered: Nov 14, '08 Location: CA |
There is no set time between when a poll is submitted, accepted, and when it goes live. It can be days, weeks, or months. And when it goes live: the same, except that polls can go live years after they were submitted (like walking dead, I presume). That's why you might see a poll from Khan going live at PU every once in a while. Unless Freddie sends you an email or does a special post, you probably won't know your poll submission has been accepted until you see it live at PU one day. That's a best-guess on my part, because the normal email confirmations from the PU site seem to have bit the dust (in the new era of PU tech-support zombie heaven). | |
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| 03-28-19 10:46am - 2002 days | #31 | |
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merc77 (0)
Disabled User Posts: 291 Registered: Apr 17, '16 |
I have had a webmaster reply to one of my reviews and he was quite civil about it. He thanked me for the review and told me he felt I was wrong on certain aspects of the review. The webmaster was never condescending to me as he knew I was a customer to his site. He does contact me with some great deals to rejoin his site from time to time. That is the way this webmaster should have replied. Sure, he can disagree and explain his side of things hoping mbaya would change the review. But he should also know mbaya is a customer and to treat him with respect. I read the review and the responses and felt the webmaster was way out of line. There are better ways to communicate than the usual I'm right you're wrong method. I did agree with the webmaster on the site as being a niche site. However, some criticisms such as lighting and video content were never addressed. A few lines stating they would make sure those problems were corrected would have gone a long way. "Dogs think people are Gods. Cats don't as they know better." - Kedi (2016) Dogs have masters; Cats have staff. | |
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| 03-28-19 11:33am - 2002 days | #32 | |
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mbaya (0)
Suspended Posts: 891 Registered: Jul 07, '08 Location: new jersey |
Thank you for your support and to everyone else as well. By using a lot of detail those who read my review can see how I felt. Exotics joined as a result of my review and some others might join as well. Exotics is not me or you, he has his own way of evaluating any site. The webmaster clearly overreacted. I did not attack him, yet he went ballistic. In the time I have been on PU I have seen this before, but thankfully not often. In every case the members were upset with such unPU like behavior. In this case and in all the others, not one of us thought the webmaster had acted appropriately. What we also did not see was a supportive response from management. Do they have our backs? Must we write only positive reviews because the negative blowback is not worth our being blunt? I gave up on getting the webmaster sanctioned in some way as he is now quiet. Really I am not asking for anything to be done in this case. If he acts up again to me, Exotics or anyone else, he will see a side of me that will make him regret his actions. No more Mr. Nice Guy after this. I have heard from management but am not sure if I want to make their response open for discussion. You won't agree with them. Edited on Mar 28, 2019, 11:46am | |
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| 03-28-19 12:37pm - 2002 days | #33 | |
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jook (0)
Active User Posts: 325 Registered: Dec 22, '13 Location: jersey city |
>>I have heard from management but am not sure if I want to make their response open for discussion. You won't agree with them. Oh man, you can't leave us hanging! Besides, a public response was called for. | |
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| 03-28-19 12:48pm - 2002 days | #34 | |
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Loki (0)
Active User Posts: 395 Registered: Jun 13, '07 Location: California |
PU is in a difficult place here, needing to balance the freedom of members to write reviews without fear of harassment with the needs of the website owners. Although I think PU should immediately condemn any signs of harassment I'm not sure posting their response to mbaya is constructive. Mbaya, you have my support, as would any member harassed by a website owner. But maybe it's time to let this go. It may be hard, but you'll definitely be the bigger man to do so. "A man talking sense to himself is no madder than a man talking nonsense not to himself." | |
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| 03-29-19 06:31am - 2001 days | #35 | |
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iknowwazzup (0)
Active User  Posts: 132 Registered: Jan 06, '16 Location: United States |
Personally, I read all the time about companies overreacting to negative feedback. All I have to say is that if I don't read at least one less than glowing review, I don't trust the positive ones. I think that you should respect your potential customers to be sophisticated enough to judge whether feedback is honest or biased. And to recognize that sometimes what's said is just based on personal taste and, therefore, it's purely opinion. (Not suggesting anything about the specific review in question - I just mean in life in general.) If I was a webmaster in a similar situation, I'd like to think that I would graciously disagree and offer a strong, but respectful rebuttal. Not lose my cool or demand a retraction. But I guess that no matter the business someone is in, many owners take things very personally. They think of their product or service in the way an artist does a painting or sculpture. You're criticizing a part of them, so they can't process it objectively. | |
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| 03-29-19 10:17am - 2001 days | #36 | |
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marcdc1 (0)
Active User Posts: 139 Registered: Jan 10, '07 Location: New York |
I just want to send my support to you mbaya. The great part about this community is its civility. It's something to cherish. If the webmaster wants to disagree with you fine. But this must be a place of civility as it has long been. | |
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