> You talk about my interpretation as if there is some ambiguity here as to who was in the wrong.
Sure there is some ambiguity and some of your interpretation; first of all, there is no way to identify person reliably on the Internet (except for digital certificates, but I really doubt they were involved).
But this is not that important, what is more important is your answer to the following question: if somebody (without any e-mails which you would interpret as coming from him) will subscribe, then come in, download one gallery and say that he's not satisfied, asking for a refund - what would you do? Will you refund or not? If no, then all the references to Josh's alleged e-mail are irrelevant, if yes, then the whole thing just didn't make any sense from business point of view - cost of time and efforts (not to mention loss of goodwill) spent on this pretty specific case has already exceeded the refund amount many-fold.
PS > Why you are blindly jumping to this guy's defence is puzzling?
It's very simple and you should expect it on the Internet, especially in places like this one: I'm a customer too, and dealing with unscrupulous merchants all the time (see for instance my comment 'Swindling alert'). I can imagine that you're dealing with fraudulent customers all the time either, but fortunately that's not my problem :-).
> Keeping customers happy, is actually something we are very proud of and something we do very well...
No comment.
> It appears from your comments that you are condolning somebody joining a pay site, downloading what they want and then demanding a refund by getting their bank or credit card company to dispute the transaction. You seem to be suggesting people should commit fraud?
That's only the way you prefer to read it. What I've said is that if there is a conflict between VISA customer and VISA merchant (and it doesn't matter what is the reason of the conflict: fraudulent charge or service so poor so it wasn't really possible to use it), one of the ways (which seems the most convenient to me) is to bring this conflict to the customer's bank to solve, that's it. And then it will be the bank who will decide how to deal with the matter. I should mention though that as far as I know, historically VISA/MC tend to like their customers much more than their merchants, so in case of doubts conflicts tend to be resolved in customer's favor. Any other questions?
> After all, this is what Josh P did...
Again, this is just your interpretation, and given the way you've interpreted my own words, personally I tend to doubt this your interpretation too. Still, in case of conflict it shouldn't be decided by me (and even less by you as you're the party of the conflict) but by appropriate conflict resolution body (like bank in the case of VISA-related conflict).
Not sure that you're listening out there (your reply was posted way too long ago), but on any account your support did an extremely poor job. First of all, keeping customers happy is a cornerstone of doing long-term business (opposed to hit-n-run businesses), and deviating from it have already cost you lots of customers (for instance, myself - I won't join the site with such a comment and such a webmaster reply).
Second, to make their customers happy, both VISA and MC have policies which allow to challenge any credit card charge quickly and efficiently (and which can be barely argued in case of website subscription with no goods physically delivered); I wonder why JoshP didn't come to his bank and say "I want to dispute the transaction of $XX.YY which appear on my statement on DD MMM 2006. I wasn't satisfied with service provided and wasn't able to solve it contacting the merchant" - usually this is enough to get full refund via your own bank (takes a few weeks but eventually does work).
PS Or maybe support is run by one of site dominatrixes? That would explain attitude, but still is a very poor way of doing business.
Thanks for explanation; as for talking to Khan - he reads it anyway (to approve), so if he agrees it's a problem, he will probably fix it sooner or later.
I've read that, but shouldn't it also be reflected on "Feedback History" page? Click on "Feedback History" link - it shows very detailed calculation (obviously aiming to explain how the rating was calculated), but end-result is DIFFERENT from the rating shown on the main page.
PU says that rating for TheTrainingOfO is 94, but there are only 2 reviews, one is 95, and another is 90, so I expect it to be 92.5. Ok, I know that there are ratings and so on, so I went to "Feedback History" and found that's it's 92.5 there. So it's 94 on site page, and 92.5 in "Feedback History". Not that it really matters much, but which one is correct?
Current Member for over 2 months (at the time of review).
Pros:
+ femsub training (by both males and females, but mostly males) combined with sex
+ strong psychological element
+ Safe, Sane and Consensual BDSM
+ most models (both male and female) really love it
+ ability to leave feedback
+ ability to download whole episode as a ZIP
+ video/image quality is good
+ cameraguy work is excellent
+ setups are good
Cons:
- still less content than other kink.com sites
- training of the same girl is divided into several episodes (which is ok), but these episodes appear not one after another, which is annoying
Bottom Line:
TheTrainingOfO is quite a recent addition to kink.com sites. It is quite similar to SexAndSumbission, but also is very different. The idea is that the same guys take one girl and train her as a good slave. It takes them 4 days to do it (actually 5 with 1 day rest), which means ability to see gradual progress of the girl. Not all girls succeed in training, but most are trained well. Site has very strong psychological element in play, and it's a bit more geared towards domination/submission theme, than towards SM or sex (though there is plenty of both SM and sex too, with all kinds of sex present, including anal).
As all other kink.com sites, TheTrainingOfO is all about SSC (Safe, Sane and Consensual) BDSM, with most models being really into the scene. Chemistry is usually excellent, and overall feeling is just great.
Site is new, but at this point they've already got about 50 episodes (which is still less than other kink.com sites, but quite enough for me).
Bottom line: one of the best BDSM sites out there, with strong emphasis on psychology, a bit physics, with lots of sex added to the mix. Highly recommended (in a sense, it's "advanced version" of SexAndSubmission, at least for me).
Was a member approx. 1 month prior to this review.
Pros:
- seems to be run by the people who're bisexuals themselves
- pretty good variety of actions
- quite good models
- lots of relevant extras ("bi position of the week", bi cartoons etc.), making it kind of 'portal'
- seem to organize some shoots themselves with members comments (what members want to see) taken into account
Cons:
- video quality
- video quality
- video quality
- did I already say "video quality?" :-)
- most videos are in other-than-English languages w/o subtitles (not that it matters that much though for this kind of content)
- site design is quite poor
Bottom Line:
The site is quite interesting as it looks not exactly usual porn site with adult content only, but more as a portal for bisexual (mostly MMF) people.
Most of the content is exclusive, but not shoot by them themselves or according to their guidelines; lots of content is bought from now defunct bi sites (they say it openly). This old content is usually horrible in video (and sometimes cameraguy work) quality. Sometimes they shoot it themselves, but (unfortunately) not too often.
Bottom line: if you're into MMF bi sex, you should definitely try it (despite all the shortcomings, other bi sites seem to be even worse), if not - still can be good if you're bored of the same patterns and are not afraid to become bi just because of looking at MMF sex :-); beware of video quality though (very low by today standards, but in this niche there might not be that much choice).
There are photosets, but they're nothing special IMHO. You can't see much emotions from them, and quality is mediocre (500px larger side), though they IMHO do not look as a screencaps.
I think they're playing "just one more step" game, going VERY GRADUALLY (stand up - take off shoes to measure height without them - a few commands to turn - now take off blouse - etc.) but for this kind of mind games it becomes absolutely important to know what they're saying.
Current Member for less than 1 month (at the time of review).
Pros:
+++ original concept
+++ very natural feeling
++ probably unscripted
++ mostly beautiful girls
+ HD video quality (1280x720)
Cons:
--- no translation, no subtitles
- collection is small
- price (29.95) is inadequate for such small collection
Bottom Line:
TotallyUndressed is a new site which has great potential which is unfortunately not realized because of one small but very important detail, if they fix it (and will produce regular updates) - for me it will become one of personal favorites.
The plot in every clip (about 20-25 minutes each) is very similar: there is a room where girls are coming to some kind of interview (maybe job interview), where they're asked some questions, then they are asked to remove shoes (to measure height, though I don't know it is related to interview), then - shirt and so on, and pretty soon they come to suck a dildo and get dildo-fucked. There is nothing unusual about this plot, but what makes it really special is how natural it feels. Girls do not look as models, they do not look as pros at all, they're shy (or playing being shy), and so on. The whole thing looks so natural that I just need to hope that it is not a REAL job interview where girls are tricked into doing this kind of things without knowing it will be all over the Internet.
Now to the bad part. As I've said, this thing looks and feels very natural, and there is a lot of conversation going on. The problem is that all this conversation goes in some language I cannot comprehend (probably Russian or something similar), and it spoils at least half of the fun.
GUYS, IF YOU ARE READING THIS - MAKE SOME EFFORT TO ADD SUBTITLES TO YOUR MOVIES (for example, the same way as FuckingGamble guys are doing it), IT WILL BECOME SO MUCH BETTER!
Technical details: video quality is nothing special but ok (1280x720 ~2Mbit/s), number of scenes is small (~15), which is IMHO ok for a new site, but price (29.95) is certainly way too steep for this amount of content.
Other details: there is NO B/G or G/G sex on TotallyUndressed, girls are just masturbating and playing with dildos. Girls are of "girl next door" type, but on more beautiful side. The plot is almost exactly the same every time, it is reaction of the girls which makes it worth looking.
Bottom line: it might be a VERY GOOD (I'd probably rate it in 90's range) if they just would add subtitles (or any other kind of translation). Unlike most adult sites, dialogs is a VERY important part of TotallyUndressed, and being kept in dark about what girls and interviewers have said, ruins most of the fun.
Current Member for less than 1 month (at the time of review).
Pros:
+++ absolutely unique concept
++ unscripted real wrestling
++ girls are mostly friendly to each other during the wrestling (though not in last round)
+ nice girls
+ good video quality (up to HD 1280x720 at about 1.5Mbit/s)
+ updated 5 times a month (with FULL episode every time)
+ user feedback and comments
+ easy site navigation
+ full movie download (instead of ZIPs).
Cons:
- action in the last round is scripted
- not too much variety in the last round
- ZIPped video download seems to be gone (replaced with full movie download)
Bottom Line:
Recently I re-joined UltimateSurrender and found that now it became even better (sorry for marketing-speak, but that's exactly my feeling).
The site is about girls wrestling almost nude to nude while getting extra points for actions like opponent pussy fingering, smothering her face with pussy and so on. Every match starts with girls wearing panties (recently bikinis were introduced), but they are removed very quickly (panties removal of the opponent means 5 points, so they have an incentive to do it). After the wrestling, winner (with the most points) gets to punish the loser in the so-called "final round", which usually includes mild humiliation, strap-on action (sometimes anal), forced pussy licking and so on.
Kink.com says that wrestling is unscripted, and I do believe it (they're about the only site I believe is unscripted); recently they even started to do some matches in front of live audience. Final round though is scripted almost for sure (or at least very strict restrictions are placed on the winners), which obviously reduces variety of final round a bit.
Video quality is very decent (up to HD 1280x720 at about 1.5Mbit/s; non-HD is also quite good with 960x540 at about 1MBit/s, pictures can be downloaded as ZIPs, recently an option to download whole video has been introduced (instead of ZIP with video parts).
Since my previous review UltimateSurrender has made several improvements, which contributed to making the site "even better". Most importantly,
they introduced tag team matches; one cannot overestimate their importance, they change the game and overall feeling COMPLETELY. The next thing was that they have made tag team matches translated 'live' and in front of live audience (which added some additional twist and adds a bit of variety). As for more minor changes, they have introduced bikinis (IMHO nice touch, but would be nicer if points are given for top removal too), provided a bit better video quality and
fixed problems with their previous crappy login system (now it works like a breeze, no need to relogin after leaving session unattended for a few hours).
Overall, after coming to this site once again, I almost lost doubt that as of now, it is THE VERY BEST site on the net for me personally, so I've upgraded it's rating to 98 (the very first 98 I've ever set on PornUsers).
Bottom line: if you are not scared by "girls-only" action and by the very concept of female wrestling, you shall at least take a look at their tour pages; BTW, better samples about this and the other kink.com sites can be found on free-hardcore.com . Admittedly, it is so unusual, that it can be "love-it-or-hate-it", but if you like the tour and samples, I think you will like it inside too.
I'm not a member myself now, but the most recent videos I have from them (maybe half a year ago or so) is 960x540 @920kbit/s, and quality is good for these parameters.
As for re-joining - if it is your cup of tea, it should be worth it, but on the other hand I shall tell that even these days things like anal are quite rare, so personally I prefer to join once in a while (probably will do it again soon), grab more intensive content (especially tag teams), and then unsubscribe.
Have you seen their "Tag Team" matches (2-girl teams)? They have been added not so long ago, and IMHO they have made a HUGE difference for the site. And if Amber is losing, it often leads to DP, though I agree that more anal overall definitely wouldn't hurt :-).
Are you sure it's a good idea to put that low rating for the site just because it's not your cup of tea? I mean that all "cons" in your review (except for the first one) are HIGHLY subjective and there are will be LOTS of people who have an exactly opposite opinion. Personally I'm at least trying to avoid setting low (especially THAT low) ratings to the sites which just aren't my cup of tea, at least if inside member area they provide essentially the same stuff as advertised on the tour pages.
> even though the winner was obvious after the first 60 seconds.
Yeah, was exactly my feeling too, but with tag teams it doesn't feel that "one-way" even if one team is outclassed (when there are 2 wrestlers from one team against one from the other, obviously they dominate regardless).
I've found that this site has improved greatly since my review. Tag teams addition is REALLY great, and overall feeling is much better too. As a result, I've upgraded score from 90 to 95 (see also a follow-up to my review).
Nice to see that some great sites are improving even further.
From the site (information for fans of Dragon Lily):
"The Dragon's stay from retirement was short lived, this will be her last match for some time if not forever. Dragon is going to be a mom! We all wish the best for her and she is very excited to begin a new chapter in her life."
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